Interview with Kat Harris
A few weeks ago I had the privilege of meeting Kat Harris through one of my favourite podcasts, Girl’s Night with Stephanie May Wilson. Kat is a podcaster herself, a speaker, online educator and a photographer. Upon roaming her Instagram and podcast I decided more people need to know about her existence. Kat boldly addresses topics such as navigating sexual desire, identity, entrepreneurship and everything in between. Her words are full of wisdom and she speaks with conviction. Not to mention, her moments of vulnerability invite you to confront your own emotions and perceptions. In this interview, Kat shares about surrendering control, how God is not embarrassed by our sexual desires and so much more. We hope you enjoy our conversation.
Who is Katherine?
Goodness--what a question! Do you have some rosé and a few hours to chat? I am a 35 year old Texas girl living in Brooklyn NY. My vision is to equip and empower women to embrace their beauty, identity and value through storytelling. I host The Refined Collective Podcast, and my first book, Sexless in the City, will drop in Spring 2021! I love me some God, Beyoncé (I mean have you seen Black is King? So good!), and am a sucker for America’s Funniest videos. I was a Bible Major in college, then moved to Southern California to work in the non-profit world which led me to the photography world, which led me to shooting fashion and editorial work in NYC...and ultimately to starting my blog The Refined Woman. Nothing about my journey has been linear or happened how I thought it would, could or should...yet here we are. I wouldn’t change a single thing!
What are some areas that have thoroughly been refined by the Lord?
A huge thing for me in this past year has been surrender and trust. I’m a doer. I’m a get ‘ish done type of girl. I like having a goal and making a plan to achieve it. But there’s some things in life like love, marriage, and navigating a global pandemic that don’t work like that. Especially in quarantine I’ve had to really embrace the unknown. And if I zoom out, I start to see in every area of my life the invitation is to surrender and trust. Nothing is in my control, but I know a good, trustworthy, faithful God who is in control and who wants to lead me step-by-step, breath-by-breath through my days...for me it’s learning to embrace that process!
What are the areas that still have their rough edges?
Ummm….all of them haha...am I allowed to say that? In no area of my life have I arrived or ‘figured things out’. Anyone who tells you different is lying!
Talking about sexuality within Christian environments can be tricky. How do you do that boldly and honorably?
I’ve always been the type of person to address the elephant in the room. So if there’s something that’s not being talked about, I want to talk about that thing. I don’t think talking about sexuality within Christian environments has to be tricky. The reality that it can be is just revealing of how much shame has been attached to it over the years. For me it’s important to always go back to Scripture and be rooted and grounded in truth and love. God is not afraid of sexuality, sex, desire, intimacy--you name it--because God created it. I mean have you read the Song of Solomon? The Old Testament book was viewed as so erotic that Hebrew boys weren’t even allowed to read it until they came of age. God doesn’t make bad, gross, or dirty things. I think a huge part of talking about this stuff is remembering that first and foremost, the whole thing was God’s idea.
How can we, married or single, value and honor our sexuality and sexual desires without idolising them?
Often when we think of sexuality and desire, we think of sex and physical intimacy. But in her profound book Redeeming Sex, Debra Hirsch, challenges that sexuality is our human desire to get outside of ourselves and connect with others. Not only that, but our spirituality is our human desire to connect with The Other aka God. In essence our sexuality is that thing that drives us outside of our experience to be in relationship and friendship with people. This ultimately is a shadow of our greater desire to be in relationship with God. Sexuality becomes infinitely more expansive when we view it this way. Is sex and physical intimacy a part of our sexuality? Yes. Absolutely. But, we are flattening sexuality when we make it all about sex. If sexuality is really about being connected with other people, then that’s great news! There’s so many ways to connect with other human beings outside of sexual intimacy. Also, it’s important to differentiate sexual desire and desire for sex. Sexual desire is a part of our sexuality, again meaning it’s the desire to connect with people. Whereas the desire for sex is a specific aspect within our sexual desire. Finally, if we don’t want to idolize our sexuality and desire, the key is to remember that all of it is a shadow of our ultimate desire for God.
What are some practical things you do and have done to put your sexual desires in their place, under God’s authority/submitting them to the Lord?
Instead of shaming it, pretending it’s not there, or stuffing it down, I first acknowledge my sexual desire. One of the most normal human experiences is the existence of sexual desire. God isn’t afraid or embarrassed of our desire. Nope. The whole thing was His idea; it’s a part of what it means to be human. And in Genesis 1 when God created humanity, He said that we were very good. That doesn’t mean only our minds or spirituality, it also includes our sexuality and desire.
Only from this place can we start to engage in a healthy conversation about desire. So for instance, say it’s a Tuesday and I think man I’d really love to have sex today. I can acknowledge and normalize that very human desire, and then invite God into that moment with me. God what do you want me to do with this desire? What would be honoring to You, myself, and the world around me? It’s when we keep desire in the dark that things go sideways.
How do you practically walk out doing things (work, relationships, life) with God and not just for God?
A relationship with God is a relationship; it’s a two way street. So whether it’s work, or I’m on a run, making dinner, or emptying the trash each moment is an opportunity to connect with and invite God into the space with you. One of the most practical ways I do this is by focusing on my breath. Scripture says that God breathed life into creation, or in other words the universe unfolded in the exhale of God. And then Scripture says God breathed the breath of life into humanity. So every inhale and every exhale is a reminder of the Creator breathing the universe and me into existence. Being with God isn’t necessarily about having a 4 hour Bible study every day; it’s about consciously putting your attention and awareness on God--looking for evidence all around you for His goodness. If we start to pay attention, we’ll begin to notice God truly is with us in each and every moment.
Having multiple streams of revenue, how do you decide what to pursue and what is simply a distraction?
Simon Sinek says a lot of people know what they do, some people know how to do it well, but very few people know why they’re doing it. It’s when you’re able to connect with the why behind the what, your purpose, calling, whatever you want to call it, that you’re able to really move the needle forward in your work, relationships, health, etc. Knowing my ‘why’ offers me a framework in what I say yes and no to. If something is out of alignment with my ‘why’ it’s an easy no. If something is in alignment then it’s all about wisdom:
- Will this move the needle forward in my life/work/etc.? If so, how.
- Is it the right time? (Timing is everything--you can have the right opportunity at the wrong time and it’ll blow up in your face).
- Do I want to do it? (Sometimes we think just because a door is open we should walk through it. Sometimes we think just because a door is closed we can’t open it. Both are untrue. Sometimes a door is open, and it’s not for you to walk through. Sometimes it’s closed, and you have to reach for the doorknob and open it. All this to say, use wisdom, ask questions, get connected to your why, what you want, and do some digging. Invite trusted people into the conversation with you.)
What are some upcoming projects we can expect to see from you?
I’m finishing up my first book under Harper Collins called Sexless in the City: a sometimes sassy, sometimes painful, always honest look at dating, desire and sex. It’s my story of growing up in Southern Christian Culture during the height of the Purity Movement and the messages I received about myself, my body, my sexuality, dating, sex, and all the things. And then moving to NYC as an almost 30 year old and figuring out I was taught a bunch of rules that evoked shame and not really given a biblical vision about all of these things...so I went on a journey to discover God’s heart for sex, intimacy, and all the things in between. And man was I shocked with what I found!
Final question, other than Beyoncé, who is headlining your solo dance party?
I mean….Destiny’s Child? Say my name, say my name...heyooo
Thank you so much for reading. You can stay connected with Kat on Instagram, @therefinedwoman or @therefinedcollective (also the name of her podcast). If you have any thoughts on our conversation, please feel free to share them with us in the comment section!
